[Staowners] Rear Light Lens

Thu Aug 2 14:21:16 EDT 2007

These are all Lucas Type 464 taillamp assemblies -- the lenses varied based 
on whether 1 or 2 bulbs in the 464 body.  These red lenses had 
correspondingly either 1 or 2 "centering cones" (Lucas nomenclature), which 
are approx. 1" Fresnel circles molded into the lens over the bulb 
location.   The red lenses are (pictures attached):

464A (Lucas 572673): one centering cone, used for one stop/marker bulb 
("Non-Flashing")

464B (Lucas 572672): two centering cones, used for one stop/marker bulb and 
one turn signal bulb (two bulbs) ("Flasher Type")

464E (Lucas 572876): Fitted to Mk3 90s (this lens is wedge-shaped and 
compensates for the curvature of the body): two centering cones, used for 
one stop/marker bulb and one turn signal bulb ("Flasher Type").  For some 
reason, the Rootes parts manual lists and shows Lucas 572888, which is a 
one bulb/centering cone lens, but most of the Mk3s I'm familiar with have 
turn signal flashers and are fitted with two-cone lenses...  By that time, 
UK cars were no longer fitted with trafficators but had turn signal 
flashers, and at the recent STAR rally, I only recall seeing two-cone 
"flasher" lenses on Mk3s -- any comment by Mk3 owners?

All of the above have either 464A, 464B, or 464E molded into the surface of 
the lens.

Just to complicate things, in later years to reduce stock, Lucas made a 
replacement lens also listed as 572672, which had three centre cones and 
thus could be used as replacements for either one or two bulb 464 
lights.  These have no "ribs" on the surface and are made of a more modern 
red glass that is a bit brighter (but the original 464As & Bs are 
remarkably bright if in good condition).   Some stockists still carry these 
replacement lenses, but are not correct for the period of our cars (but 
perfectly functional).

Relative rarity:

--464As are relatively available and can be picked up at UK autojumbles for 
as little as 50p -- these were fitted to a lot of UK cars.

--The 464Bs are getting quite rare and fetch a premium whenever they show 
up on eBay (this I know from experience).  These I speculate were fitted 
mostly to cars exported from the UK.

--The 464Es (for the Mk3) are mildly rare and can be reasonably priced; 
they were fitted to many cars as well following the demise of trafficators.

Regarding reversing lights, generally only Mk3s were fitted with the number 
plate lights that incorporated a reversing lens (although some folks I've 
consulted are of the opinion that some earlier cars, particularly export 
Alpines, were also fitted with the reversing lens number plate lights).  If 
you are using red lenses with a non-reversing number plate light, 
appropriate period Lucas reversing lights would be the ubiquitous Type 494 
or possibly Type 661.

Hope this is useful.

Cheers! --Max

At 11:14 AM 8/2/2007, Mal Clark wrote:
>Hi all, wonder if some of you over in the other parts of the world can 
>answer a question,asked of me by Bob Stewart,(Aussie Bob) as we know 
>export Sunbeam Talbots and Alpines didnt have Indicator arms, But had 
>Flashing indicators, he wants to know what configurations was on the rear 
>lights as far as the lens go, according to the parts manual, export 
>Sunbeams had two types of rear lens a Lucas number of 572673 listed as Non 
>Flashing Lens,and a Lucas Number of 572672 Flashing lens,these are not the 
>numbers for the Mk3 Sunbeams,which I think used the same red lens for all 
>world supply, Back to the two others mentioned above, I have a flat red 
>lens off of my early ex USA Alpine,but want to know what the other lens 
>was? no pictures of these lens in Parts Book, and are these lens easly 
>obtained,? Bob has reproduced the Curved White lens for the rear of the 
>home market cars and what we had here in Aus,and is willing to produce the 
>red lens for export cars,anyone help. last question,if all the export cars 
>had red rear lens,can we assume there were no provision, (apart from MK3) 
>for reverse lights?  Thanks Mal Clark.
>_______________________________________________
>Staowners mailing list
>Staowners at sunbeamtalbot.info
>http://sunbeamtalbot.info/mailman/listinfo/staowners_sunbeamtalbot.info

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  Max King, Ph.D.
  Office of the Vice Provost for University Life
  University of Pennsylvania
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